http://news.cnet.com/8301-31322_3-20010352-256.html

http://blogs.consumerreports.org/electronics/2010/07/apple-iphone-4-antenna-issue-iphone4-problems-dropped-calls-lab-test-confirmed-problem-issues-signal-strength-att-network-gsm.html

"iPhone 4"

Anyway, I actually saw a video showing this phenomenon, and I have to wonder if that many people really do naturally use this "death grip" when they hold their phone. Basically hold it with your palm covering the side completely (looks uncomfortable to me) and squeeze the phone fairly hard. Seriously, the hand of the guy I saw doing it had indents after he was done. Hard to believe it affects people that are just trying to use their phone naturally.

Anyway, I'm not saying it's not a problem and Apple really should've caught this somewhere along the line. If the xbox didn't get a recall, I find it hard to believe that the iPhone 4 will, but I'll be interested to see how they handle the PR nightmare. Much more likely than a recall would be giving purchasers free bumpers for the phone, which completely solves the problem (really Consumer Reports? Tape? Are you joking? Why not recommend a bumper or a case?). Personally, there's no way I wouldn't use a case for my iPhone and I found a really cute one that I love, so this issue doesn't affect me either way...even if I decide to hold it like I'm using it to butcher a cow, like the people in these videos do.

I know that you can't tell, but I love my new phone.

Microsoft relented and extended their warranty to three years.

Also, I created this topic at 4AM. Mistakes in thread titles will happen.

Microsoft relented and extended their warranty to three years.

Also, I created this topic at 4AM. Mistakes in thread titles will happen.

Yeah, I know, but that's a stop gap measure. People have had the red lights thing after the 3 year warranty expired. It's still a problem. Also not the only problem that seems to plague an inordinate number of xbox owners, like failed disc drives, scratched discs, and that E74 thing, or whatev. Just making the comparison that that was a huge issue and didn't result in a recall, and I don't see this resulting in one either, that's all. Like I said, I can see free bumpers being given out, but not a recall.

I know...I didn't make a big deal about it. Just made a little correction and moved on. I wasn't trying to pick on you or anything.

Leo Laporte and the other gius over at TWiT did a great podcast about this. They laughed about how everyone in North America became an expect in cell phone antennas and radio waves the day of the iPhone 4 was launched. They point out that every single cell phone every created since the early 70's has this "death grip" problem because the types of radio waves (or what they are, since I don't remember), are too large to penetrate the cell structures of the human skin. So of you older guys here will remember when phone (cordless or cellular) had those pull out antennas, and if you wrapped you're hand around that attena your called would drop. It's a great podcast.

Leo Laporte

To sum up the show .. "If you love smart phones and don't care about making phone calls .. then go with an iPhone. If you need to make calls .. find another phone or carry two.)

What this turned into was a PR nightmare for Apple and a Flame War for Fanboys. A few of my friends who hate Apple Products have gone on lengthy rants about how this phone is crap even though they have never used, held. or even SEEN one, but hey .. their experts on them now.

Apple can come right out and mention this, if it's known by everyone.

If that leaked internal memo is true - "We ARE NOT appeasing customers with free bumpers – DON'T promise a free bumper to customers." and that's part of their support line "fix", "e. The use of a case or Bumper that is made out of rubber or plastic may improve wireless performance by keeping your hand from directly covering these areas."... don't either of you find that suspect or wrong? Pointing to other bad behavior doesn't prove anything. It's still bad behavior.

Also, why was there no signal loss when an Ove Glove was used with a hand in it? There was still human skin to go through.

"This test produced the best results with zero signal loss, even trumping the results I got with the bumper earlier! Another plus, the Ove Glove is half the price of the bumper."

http://whenwillapple.com/blog/2010/06/24/further-investigation-into-the-iphone-in-hand-signal-issues/

I'm in no means a fanboy. Don't even know how that figures into all this. I have an ancient cell phone that lies dead in the glove box of my truck. I'll tell you what I don't like, though. Steve Jobs and his business practices. Heck, even the people that must own the latest Apple whatever. "iBrick" was correct in that video I posted in the video section awhile back. So, if there are fanboys and they need calling out, it's the people that rush out to buy Apple's latest iWhatever. It's like Pokemon for adults. lol

If any of you want to keep putting money into Steve Jobs bank account, that's fine by me. He is an evil man, though, and I will call him on all his crap. Like how he duped Wozniak (his closest friend), out of thousands of dollars. Not only did he lie to him about how much they'd make from that bonus at Atari, but he also lied about there being a time frame of four days. You see, Jobs was leaving in four days and wanted some extra money for his trip. They made $5,000 in bonuses by reducing the amount of chips needed in Breakout. Wozniak got $350. What a pal!

Ellipsis ellipsis ellipsis

Oh I agree with you on this .. even though the iPhone 4 does suffer from an incredible bad design flaw, the reaction this phone is getting is outrageous. I agree with the whole ".. come on people. It's just a phone." I'm an Apple user .. I love my iMac, I love Final Cut, I'll get an iPad eventually (I'm going to use as a protfolio for job interview for video post production and animation since it'll be easier to have that than a laptop or portable DVD player), I don't have an iPhone yet (or any smart phone) but will likely get mine around August (mostly a money issue), and I like iPods and iTunes. I was going to change over from AT&T to Verizon (I hate Verizon as a company) but now AT&T has a decent plan to Canada so I'll stick with them.

Honestly I'm baffled by the people that flock to Mac stores, wait in line for hours or days just to be the first, and buy every new iteration of one of their products whether it's a complete over haul (iMacs) or a simple colour change (iPhones) .. like .. f**K people .. get a life!! It is an interesting study of what our culture is turning into though. Why do people go batshit crazy for Mac .. hell if I know.

As far as Papa Steve being evil .. sure find me someone at that level who isn't. You think people like Bill Gates, Richard Branson, Martha Stewart or any other millionaire/billionaire haven't done things like that before. Even Oprah has been called out on several of her "charitable donations" as ways of funding her own personal popularity and lifestyle. Not giving Jobs money is going to pretty damn hard nowadays too since he's the major stock holder of Pixar/Disney and with Disney owning Marvel are you going to stop watching those movies and comics as well?

Trust me PK .. I agree with you on a lot of this, and yes Apple can certainly give out a band that cost .. what .. 3 cents to make .. to every iPhone user on the planet. But they wont and the simple answer to that is "Why give away what you can sell?" .. and the fanboys will line up in heat for days to buy it. I don't understand it but I love watching it happen. .. Where's COW in all this .. I'm interested in hearing his non-AT&T opinion.

The difference is, Jobs swindled Wozniak before they were rich. Jobs was working for Atari and still designing in his garage with Woz. For me, that equates to; once a dick, always a dick. I do love the spin Woz puts on it now, though. He calls it a "prank" that Jobs pulled on him.

As far as people not giving him any money, that's for them to decide. Maybe they don't realize he's a total douche yet. Doubtful, though. He's been a douche a long time, and not many seem to care. The latest in electronics, seems to outweigh integrity and decency.

I realize many in the business world are cut throats. Doesn't mean it's okay or should be a model for success. Just the way he's pushing HTML5 over Flash bothers me. Because everyone much prefers loading their movies via Quicktime, than any other freaking way possible. *sarcasm* If the public doesn't want HTML5, and prefer Flash, it doesn't matter to him. He will force it into use.

I agree his arrogance is without a doubt one of the worst in any business .. but it's not that far off from others. Simply look at your 360 to understand how the likes of Gates/Ballmer think. You HAVE to use Microsoft products and plugging anything else into that machine will void the warranty. Jobs act any differently than anyone else in his position, and much like you, out of all these CEO/Developers I like Woz the most. He doesn't seem to have a problem with any fall out him and Jobs had, and he still waits in line for Apple products proving the guy doesn't hold a grudge.

I could careless how Jobs acts or what he says .. he's just another CEO and I like the products his company makes. I've only watched 2 Apple press conferences because I really don't care to listen to him .. or any of these other people talk about how awesome they are.

I do support his HTML5 over Flash, but you and I have already had that conversation and there's no need to retread that. I'm still baffeled by this love/hate thing with Apple. I can't even deal with being in the store at the mall anymore because it's absolutely insane!!! It's almost like Walmart for rich people .. tons of staff .. no one around to help .. old people asking thousands of questions that a simple Google check could answers.. kids bouncing off the walls .. good there are so many kids in that store .. it's nut house. Jobs knows this and he sells to these people. One guy I used to work with is one of these Apple Fanboys and his status update would be things like "OS Snow Leopard", "iPhone 4", "iPad" .. he doesn't say what their like he just wants the rest of the world to know he has one. SHUT THE **** UP ******* .. but those are the fans and the people with money and Jobs knows they'll buy whatever crap he sells. It's not a bad business plan to set up for a company.

Pointing to other bad behavior, just shows two examples of bad behavior. It doesn't cancel one out and suddenly make it good. =]

Two wrongs make a right, Peeknuckle .. it's simple math!

I don't look into the character of the car salesman that I bought a car from and I don't look into that person who got commission from the dress I bought the other day. Mel Gibson is an abusive a-hole, and I still like some of his movies, according to "Pirates of Silicon Valley" (really good movie), Steve Jobs is a **** with and anger management problem and Bill Gates is a weasley thief and Steve Ballmer's a dufus butt-head. If they come out with products I like, I don't care about their personal character flaws. I probably wouldn't like any CEO, actor, or singer in real life.

As far as the free bumper thing...yeah, that's just good business at this point. Giving away $40 (or whatever) free business will lose money. Might as well hate Apple stock holders for that though, since they also wouldn't like the decision to give them away. When I say that they'll give them away, I mean that they'll give them away if it comes down to that or a mass recall. I still have yet to talk to any of my friends with an iPhone 4 that have this problem, unless they try to cause the problem for fun. Nobody I know holds their phone like that.

Just for fun.

http://www.tipb.com/...m-study-flawed/

And I love how consumer reports says they can't recommend the iPhone, but listed it as the best smartphone on the planet.

The iPhone scored high, in part because it sports the sharpest display and best video camera we've seen on any phone, and even outshines its high-scoring predecessors with improved battery life and such new features as a front-facing camera for video chats and a built-in gyroscope that turns the phone into a super-responsive game controller. But Apple needs to come up with a permanent—and free—fix for the antenna problem before we can recommend the iPhone 4.

Again, pointing to other bad behavior or people who behave badly, doesn't do anything. I can bet though, that if you were buying a dress and the person helping you treated you like crap, that you wouldn't return to that store. Same goes for the car lot and any other example you care to give.

My point wasn't whether or not they're bad. My point is that I don't care about their personal life or if they're good people when I'm buying a product off of them. If they create something I want, charge me the right price, get me the car and the options I want, I'm not going to delve into their relationship history, whether they get along with the coworkers, whether they overcharged someone else. I wouldn't look into it. I'm not excusing his behavior, I'm saying that it won't affect me buying a product that I their company makes or sells if I want it. I'm sure there are tons very nice men and women that work at those places too. Some of the money I spend is going in their pockets too.

Or sweat shops.

Alright, I'll weigh in on this subject. I own an iPhone 3G and love it. The upgrade to a 3GS, while tempting, I talked myself out of because there just weren't enough enhancements to the product to warrant a purchase from me. Looking at the features of the iPhone 4, I STILL can't justify the upgrade. Now with all these antenna problems, which I have witnessed first hand while using my buddies' new phone at the office just kills it for me. I tried making a call and used my normal grip on the phone and my call dropped every single time. Now, I have rather large hands and while everyone calls it the "death grip", you don't have to hold it like a ham fisted freak. All you need is one finger to hit the antenna "bar" and it's lights out. If they are able to fix this problem with the hardware, I may change my mind, but as it stands, no dice.

And as for people's love of Apple? A fanboy is a fanboy, no matter the company. Our office is full of Evo 4G and Blackberry snobs that look down on us iPhone users, so it works both ways. I hate fanboys of all kinds, be it Apple, Microsoft, Sony, or even down to a particular cell or internet provider. Good day everyone.

I tried making a call and used my normal grip on the phone and my call dropped every single time. Now, I have rather large hands

This is good to know. I'll warn people with bigger hands away, or just recommend a case, which I do normally anyway. You're the first person I know, who's had a real world problem with this on a consistent basis. Most of the people making a big deal about this, are trying to make it happen.

I have rather dainty hands and just plain don't hold the phone in such a way where this is an issue at all. The fact that I always buy a case for the iPhone anyway, makes the point completely moot. For the majority of people, I doubt this will really be an issue, but no phone is perfect for everybody, no matter what company has made it, who their CEO is, or what issues it has. I understand not liking fanboys, but the people that are just as annoying are the ones who hate something just because it's popular. Not saying anyone here is like that, but there are a ton of people who just despise the iPhone for no other reason than so many people get them. They've hit on something that a lot of people like...get over it. And I love when people slam Apple and say that the iPhone sucks and buy a touch phone, that the iPhone created and showed there was a market for, although people may deny it. Anyone try a touch phone before the iPhone. They sucked.

New article shows that the estimated cost of an iPhone 4 recall would be $1.5 Billion.

Link ----> YIKES!

Yeah, free bumpers may not be looking like such a big deal now, do they Steve? I'll take a Pink one please...ooh, or maybe green...

I too am not really affected by the call drop or signal lost. Although, I usually end up pressing mute, facetime, or end call while talking on the phone without a case or anything. Sort of wish I had something to fix thiat.

Give myincipio.com a try. I love my chrome Zune case.

Apple will be holding a press event on Friday @ 10PT.

Guess will find out what they're going to do about this issue soon enough.

God .. I'm going to have to stay off the internet on Friday. I hate the internet when there's an Apple press conference. Lets hope they give out free bumpers.

LoL

lol

I would say I'm holding off on buying one till I see what happens, but Apple is enough of an *** to any country which isn't Tier 1 that they're doing it for me. Over a month since the iPhone was announced and Apple haven't even given our Networks so much as an inkling of a release date. And their feckin EMEA HQ is in Cork the ********